stuie

Cliches as always. Offered you a truce because I'm sick of the rubbish on here. Says a lot that you were too "internet cool" for it. Jog on parrot, not interested in your web battles.

There was no offer. If you think Demonland resembles anything at all to do with the real world then I would not come back from the walk champ.

No my child, but I have risen.

Offered him a "virtual handshake" and truce seeing it was such a scheizen day for all of us. He was too "virtually" tough for that though. I'm on a truce fest today, this club is too frustrating and disappointing for us to fight so much on the internet with each other.

Yep, that helped too, but having a pack of 6 players in the way wherever you want to go didn't help...

No coincidence that the forward line structure improved in the last quarter when Pedo was put into the backline.

Looks pretty good this bloke hey....

Good point, forgot about that! Would still rather go for someone younger with a bit of potential left. Just try our luck, nothing to lose.

Mate, you seem to be missing my point. I've not once argued that Viney didn't want Wines. But if you look at actual evidence (rather than the hearsay you've provided about Viney/Wines) then you will see Toumpas was clearly rated higher than Wines pre-draft by the overwhelming majority of recruiters, football staff, experts (Shifter said he wouldn't be surprised to see him go number 1) and media commentators. It's an actual fact. Not sure why you're arguing that?

We already know what he can bring and do, why wouldn't we try a state league player and try to unearth something? (ie - vB) Cross slowed considerably as the season went on last year, couldn't see him contributing much next year with a developed game plan that involves more speed and attack and a bit less of the loose man in defence tactic.

Haha... Lots of players putting their hands up to take his spot, he's definitely bringing all the boys to the yard...

You provided "evidence" that Schwarz said Viney wanted Wines, not that Toumpas was rated as the better draft pick.

Completely agree.

They did say "at best".....

Interesting thought from the Hun that the Melksham ban could possibly save Grimes' career.... "With Jake Melksham suspended for the 2016 season due to the CAS guilty verdict, there’s a golden opportunity for Grimes to regain the faith of Demons supporters at half-back. At his best, the 26-year-old is a courageous defender who can break games open off half-back. We saw that consistently during Grimes’ career-best 2012 season, but injury and inconsistency have plagued the former captain over the past three years. Out of contract at season’s end, Grimes will be seeking a convincing, consistent year to ensure he earns another deal with the Dees." 2016 Blowtorch

Must be because you're sticking to your bananas thread like a good boy...

"Info"?..... Right.... A nameless club official who you, and apparently no one else, heard commenting on something beyond their control at the AGM... Ok champ. Tell you what, write to PJ and ask him why it wasn't only a "few weeks" like you were promised, and if he replies with "sorry DC, we didn't even think it could possibly ever be more than a couple of weeks for taking banned substances when every other player banned has copped at least a year" then I will apologize.

The main talk is that the players will sue Essendon and be "paid" that way.

Right, and Frost will only be out 4-6, Scully is staying with the Dees, and Neeld has the full backing of the club.... Seriously, go over those names again, Roos, Viney, Mahoney, McCartney (formerly of Essendon), Goodwin (formerly of Essendon) & Jackson (formerly of Essendon). Especially that last name, does he strike you as the sort of bloke to not plan for worst possible outcome? But no, "Daisycutter" from Demonland heard a random "official from the club" on the night when the board gets elected say it would be a few weeks, and now knows better than PJ whose usual football business strategy is apparently "nah mate she'll be right, coupla weeks".... Naive.

And if you want to believe Roos, Viney, Mahoney, McCartney (formerly of Essendon), Goodwin (formerly of Essendon) & Jackson (formerly of Essendon) didn't consider every possible outcome then go ahead....

So few seem to understand this.

So basically... blah blah blah... They're pretty much as good as each other but Jones is a better captain. Got it. You gave your opinion and I gave mine. Don't go having a sook because someone comments on your opinion when you post it on a discussion forum. Sure stats matter, but they're only part of the story and you were completely ignoring context, leadership and performance in their career peaks rather than one decent year. Give me Jones who does it week in week out over Cotchin who even by your admission has only had one good year.

Not completely his fault given he's been our one decent midfielder for the last 6 years.

That's all he ever does mate. Has 0 understanding of the game, or the context of those stats and awards. He's the prototype armchair expert.

As usual you take a simplistic look at things that will suit your agenda. The fact is there's not a big enough difference in their key stats to clearly say one is way better. And no, numbers don't "usually go up", especially if you're talking about a 28 year old. But aside from that, you're forgetting about context, as usual. As you said, Cotchin was in a "superior" team, meaning he had far more support, help with tags, better structures and coaching, more wins, all things that would help you perform better. Jones has almost identical stats over a longer period of time in a team where he has been the sole target of opposition midfields, has had 0 support, terrible coaching and far less wins. On top of that, Cotchin (as many others have mentioned) is not much of a leader and there's no way in hell he would have been able to carry a club every week the way Jones has/does. Also, you seem to be changing your argument to Cotchin is more "talented". No one will disagree with that, but that's not what you were saying. You were saying you would take him ahead of Jones, and there is no way in hell Cotchin would have done anywhere near as much in the red and blue as he has for the Tigers. You yourself say Cotchin has been "disappointing over the last 3 years" which at 25 is the peak of his career, and at a time the Tigers were meant to be challenging. Clearly he has struggled with leadership impacting his game, whereas Jones has elevated his game since becoming captain. Cotchin may be more naturally talented, but Jones has shown the type of leadership, heart, character and determination that you would want for a team in our situation. But you know, if you're happy with a captain who by your own admission has been disappointing since becoming one then it shows how little understanding you actually have of the game.